The Project
There have been a lot of numbers thrown around for the cost of the streetcar and where it runs. This map breaks it down by section on what the project really costs. There are essentially 3 different legs in the initial phases.
- Banks/Downtown/Over-the-Rhine $102 million
- Over-the-Rhine/University of Cincinnati $30 million
- University of Cincinnati/Uptown/Zoo $53 million
This map illustrates the initial phases and possible extensions. View a larger interactive GoogleMap version here.
February 2, 2009 at 4:38 pm
I can only imagine how wonderful it will be when one is able to hop on a streetcar at any point along its route and make it to the zoo, Newport on the levee, Covington, the Banks, the Stadium, back home to OTR, to work in clifton…etc, etc. All without having to set foot in a car once and without having to pay for parking or look for a spot to park.
What is Cincinnati waiting for!? This is such a smart idea I can’t even stand it!
February 2, 2009 at 5:56 pm
Jason, all those places are already served with bus service.
If you live in OTR, you can easily get to most of those places on a bike or walking.
Just ditch the car now.
February 2, 2009 at 11:17 pm
It will be pretty amazing once a system like this is reintroduced to Cincinnati. The city was built off of streetcars, it just makes sense on so many levels.
February 2, 2009 at 11:31 pm
I’m a little confused about how the circulators work. If I’m at the zoo, do I need to wait for a streetcar, make my way to Vine and McMillan, wait for another line, travel down to Race, then wait for another streetcar to take me downtown?
I really hope not. I know that this thing will be built in phases, but why not just have a line that runs from Great American to the Zoo?
February 3, 2009 at 4:43 am
Have you ever waited for a Cincinnati Metro bus? They frequently don’t even show up at their scheduled time. Not only that, but their schedules and routes are very confusing. A simple rail system like this makes the route dependable, predictable, and stable. You can actually SEE the route right in front of you so you always know where the train will take you.
And yes, I agree those areas are accesible by bike and walking. In fact, when the weather is cooperative, I primarily use my bike or walk as much as possible. For instance, I ride my bike from my place in OTR to Good Sam Hospital (where I work) everyday when the weather is not freezing or wet. However, when its super cold, raining, or snowing this is not a realistic option. Additionally, this route requires riding up fairly steep hills that most people would not be willing to do on a daily basis back and forth from work. The streetcar will allow these routes to be navigated easily regardless of the weather. I’d be able to ditch my car year round instead of just in the spring and summer months.
February 3, 2009 at 1:46 pm
John, you are absolutely right. If you have to take multiple layovers or make sure you are on a “through” car it will be confusing and inconvenient and people will shy away from it.
I think a much better plan would be disconnected loops serving specific areas.
Use the bus (with lotsa seats) to get from the riverfront to the zoo.
February 3, 2009 at 6:10 pm
The proposed street car system is not so much about moving people from point A to point B but about repopulating a city or neighborhood. If you have ever seen a street car system such as Portland, Oregons you would be amazed at the shear number of people that choose to live along the street car line and within a 3 block distance either side of the line. It is the fastest and most reliable way to repopulate your city or neighborhood. Without increasing the population we will all experience an increasing tax burden with diminishing public services. The lifestyle that the street car creates attracts people and accomplishes this goal. Moving people is secondary but an added benefit nontheless!
February 3, 2009 at 10:32 pm
Quimbob,
I’m not trying to argue that streetcars aren’t a good idea. I just think they people can’t be so blinded by “14 billion dollars worth of development” that they forget to design a system that makes sense.
I DO think that rail transit holds a huge advantage over buses, and it is primarily an image issue. People ride rail, where they won’t ride buses. I’ve seen it in others and I’ve seen it in myself while visiting other cities.
I don’t really buy the ‘more reliable’ argument. I ride Metro and for the most part it is very reliable. And I don’t see why a streetcar would be any more reliable (it’s not like a subway, where it’s not at the mercy of traffic, weather, etc.)
But I just simply think that rail attracts ridership and will stimulate investment … I’m hoping that this spurs more rail in our region … and finally I’m just super excited that Cincinnati is doing something bold and different!
February 4, 2009 at 10:39 am
Whoa … where did the $14 billion in development number come from?
The only number out there is $1.4 billion in the CBD and OTR over fifteen years. That’s new developmment.
You would have increases in existing property values too, but it probably doesn’t get anywhere near $14 billion in any of our lifetimes.
February 4, 2009 at 11:20 pm
I’m such a huge supporter of the streetcar.
We lived in Berlin almost 10 years ago now, and I loved taking the trams round town. I do take lots of buses now — as I did then — but the streetcar definitely adds to the urban experience.
One question: I was under the impression that the route was not yet set in stone? We live in CUF just above OTR and neighbors have been discussing/ hoping for (perhaps it’s just a fantasy) West Clifton versus Vine (which is strangely hard to access from its immediate west-lying neighborhood).
February 5, 2009 at 11:27 am
^ You’re right, a preferred route to Uptown has not been selected. This is just a “possible” extension.
February 5, 2009 at 5:21 pm
^ I’m very doubtful that the streetcar can climb the Clifton hill. Too steep, too curvy, and not very comfortable on a vehicle where most people stand. Stand up on one of the #17 buses going up or down the hill, and you’ll see what I mean.
Sure, the old streetcars could do it, but they were much smaller vehicles and everyone had a seat.
It’s too bad, because you have everything else going for you in CUF to make transit work — density, lack of parking, transit-dependent households, and students who would be early adopters.
The best way to serve CUF is via Gilbert to Hughes Corner along the Taft-Calhoun/McMillan pair. From Fountain Sqaure, it’s straighter, flatter, passes more businesses and vacant land for development and … it’s faster. Drive both routes sometime, you’ll see.
February 9, 2009 at 9:34 am
John,
As I understand it, streetcar builders have said, modern streetcars have the capability to service West Clifton with no problem. I continue to think, the best way to serve CUF, and also help insure the success of the plan, is to use the W. Clifton route; through the center of the most densely populated residential neighborhood in the City. The route you propose may add too much cost for the plan to bear.
February 12, 2009 at 3:37 pm
That map does scare me frankly. This needs to be a cohesive, well though-out system in order to be a success. The map there is a certain failure to be frank. If I have to change line three times to get two miles (hospital to the riverfront) I’m just plain not going to ride it. Honestly the only thing that makes sense to me is extended lines. One from clifton to downtown, one from downtown to n. kentucky.
February 19, 2009 at 9:02 am
^The different colors represent the phases in which the streetcar would be built, not necessarily individual lines. The Red, Teal, Blue sections would all be a one seat ride; as would the Light Green Teal/Blue, or the Brown/Blue.
March 14, 2009 at 7:44 am
This is the first time I comment here and I should say that you give us genuine, and quality information for other bloggers! Good job.
p.s. You have a very good template . Where have you got it from?
March 18, 2009 at 10:44 pm
Thought we already had this service. It’s called Tank & Metro